

The Great Messi Question
By: Isaiah | July 23rd, 2008
Just as the final decision by the board will be made on whether or not to let Leo Messi join Argentina’s push for another Olympic victory, I thought I would weigh in this complicated business of club vs sorta country.
Let’s start with the overarching themes involved in this discussion:
1. The Olympics are a U-23 competition with 3 age exemptions. That means that you can select a squad of 20 players who are 23 and under and 3 players who are over 23 (or any combination not exceeding the 3 over-23 players).
2. The Olympic competition is not a FIFA-sanctioned tournament and is thus time is not allotted for it under the FIFA calendar. This is, for example, in direct contrast with the World Cup, meaning that World Cup qualifiers force club competitions to stop or deal with the absence of their players during that the days allotted for WCQs.
Those are the essential points involved. Technically, according to FIFA regulations, clubs do not have to release their players to compete in the Olympics, but most do because those players are not vital to their opening few matches, which are generally friendlies due to when the Olympics take place. That this year’s Olympics takes place in August is no different than any other time (except Sydney 2000 which took place starting on Sept 1 due to the location), but the general trend towards pushing the club season further into August has put tremendous pressure on teams who are forced to qualify for various European tournaments. Barcelona is one such club, obviously.
Failure to qualify for the Champions League would be regarded as a major blow to the club’s season even before it really started. Thus the ever-increasing importance of young players, who clubs rely on more and more as the years go by, and the ever-increasing attempts by clubs to keep their young players out of non-sanctioned competitions.
The cases of Rafinha and Diego in Germany could very well determine Barcelona’s approach to “el caso Messi”. In those cases, the German Football Association (DFB) sided with the clubs attempting to keep their players, as did UEFA. The Spanish FA has given tacit approval of Barcelona’s attempt to keep Messi out of the Olympics. Sepp Blatter, FIFA president, insists the players must be allowed to leave.
Soccernet quotes him in an article as saying, ‘”The release of players below the age of 23 has always been mandatory for all clubs. The same principle shall apply for Beijing 2008.” The fact that this tournament is not included in the co-ordinated international match calendar “does not mean that there is no release obligation for the relevant clubs,” he added.’
I imagine that lawyers could argue both sides until blue in the face, but the fact remains that it is not part of the match calendar. That’s a big deal and it’s one that Schalke 04 and Werder Bremen are going to argue intensely. The “spirit of the rules” may be invoked by FIFA and they may win in the Court of Arbitration for Sport, but it will, in the end, be a pretty monumental case — at least until FIFA changes the rules and puts the Olympics on the official calendar.*
Then there’s the point of basic human decency on the part of the clubs. Do you let a player go who says he wants to play in the Olympics almost as much as he wants to play in the World Cup? You only get a few years in which to participate (sometimes just one chance, depending on when you become a pro), so shouldn’t clubs, especially rich ones, let players go? It’s good for morale and it might even be good for the development of your team because your second string players will get more serious competition under their belts before the return of the stars. Certainly it’s good to get some more experience for the younger players if they’re not starters (think Royston Drenthe or even ManU’s Anderson), but what of teams that are vying for the aforementioned European spots and will be losing important pieces of their squads to a competition that isn’t even on the FIFA calendar?
You can go either way on this one and I’d like your opinions on the matter, but, first, here’s mine: I do not want Lionel Messi to go to the Olympics. It’s not because I think that the clubs should win out over country, but rather because the season is far too long as it is and “club vs country” loses its sting as an argument when you’ve got 10 competitions to choose from throughout the year. Olympics, Euro2008, Copa America, Confederations Cup, World Cup qualifiers, etc. And that’s just the internationals. Champions League, Copa del Rey, Copa Catalunya, La Liga, to name just the ones Barcelona is involved in (you can add a couple more if you’re an English team). That amounts to too many games over too short a period of time. But if you’re going to have that many club competitions, cut down on the number of internationals. Or vice versa. There’s too much overlap and too much wrangling on everyone’s part to either keep their players or be allowed to play.
I personally don’t care for the Olympics because the whole idea of a unity competition was lost years ago in the Cold War when it became an “I’m better than you at sports, thus my country is better than yours” pissing contest. China has reinvigorated that ethos this year in an attempt to establish itself as a true world superpower, which is just dumb. The Olympics have lost their shine and I, for one, will be watching very little of them, as much as I love a myriad of sports going on at once. Thus, I do not support Lionel Messi leaving his club to compete in a silly tournament for kids. He’s above that in skill, so why bother? A gold medal? Not as cool as a Champions League trophy in my eyes.
But what do you think?
*They may not be able to do so because it’s a U-23 competition, but I’m not sure how that works.
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Comments
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That match was interesting wasn’t it. Not that we should pay a lot of attention to them after last season but hey.
Jeffren showed that he could move up to the first team when needed next season. He was impressive and intelligent going forward. Two assists for a second half sub isn’t bad.
Gudjohnsen was fantastic. No that surely was a typo. Have we signed a guddy lookalike who played very well against weak opposition. If we don’t find a new home for him I expect he’ll play a few times as attacking midfielder and Hleb or Iniesta will be pushed forward and we won’t sign a winger. Two good goals.
Messi 10 may be a big selling shirt this season. He also finished well as expected.
Yaya Toure got himself into the box to score when Keita was on the field.
Bojan scored as per usual. He is unbelievably good for one so young. All we have to do is beef him up a bit and we’ll be sorted. I’d love if he got 20 goals this season.On the Berbatov thing - he is definitely well capable outside the box. His link up play is better than any of the other options mentioned. He may not work as hard tracking back as others but he is always working himself into dangerous areas for when there are breaks. He is very intellgient, physically strong, great technique and should settle into a Champions League team fairly easily.
Posted from
Ireland

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Just watched the entire game on the links above. good game. was it me or did Caceres look out of position, in the back???
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Australia

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Thanks for the support guys. Hope to see you all more often ya!
Cheers…Posted from
Malaysia

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jeffren did look good and was responsible for bojan’s goal — though bojan finished very well.
eto’o didnt get involved much but did set up keita nicely — keita sailed it over.
and yes caceres seemed overeager to rush forward with the ball. but he was fast.
too early to really say much else about this. you can find the six goals on youtube…
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United States

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watch especially the highlights for the 3rd goal, guddy’s second — the build up is amazing:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=kYqqNQfCpu0
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United States

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Messi needs to learn to pass more often, he gets into good positions, but instead of laying it on the plate for someone else, takes a crack at goal himself but screws up…
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United States

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ya JC..there’s always a fine line between helping your team-mates and self-confidence! Messi did seem very eager to play yesterday though which I don’t know is good for him or not in the long run in the season….
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United States

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I always think it’s a great thing when players are going all-out. Sometimes they err on the side of selfishness, but isn’t that just what we here on this blog (the writers, Kevin and I, as well as the commenters) have been asking Messi do?
Messi should be Messi, which means he should be the great player he is, and then he should adapt as defenses adapt to him. If we nab Arshavin, that might never happen because a true left wing threat could always be put on, thus distracting and stretching the defense, pulling markers away from Messi and opening even more channels.
Obviously Messi should probably tone it down for the preseason, but the kid has desire and I will not ask him to do so if what he wants to do is go out and play. His link ups with Alves are very important and showing the new teammate what he can do is necessary for true cohesion. So let them go all out and destroy Hibernian 0-6 and let’s just enjoy it and let Guardiola worry about if Messi is putting too much effort into preseason.
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guardiola said he was happy with the fact that yesterday messi was receiving the ball inside or close to the box, instead of having to dribble longer distances. when he receives the ball closer to goal, the idea is that he *should* take people on, and try to separate/create space for a shot. but i think guardiola noticed the problem last season of messi receiving the ball at the mid-line and dribbling too much, and is working to change this — obviously having alves there will make a difference.
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United States

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Its just that the scars from last season just don’t seem to go away for me…we looked like an awesome team going into the season..and even in the first couple of matches (vs. Zarragoza at the camp anyone!!!
)…then it all came down crashing..and while there were so many reasons, one of the big ones was Messi injured too..and the general health of the team in the latter part of the season..as fans with limited access we can just hope and read of the new things Guardiola is doing with the medical staff …and hope that is not the case this seasonPosted from
United States

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Barcelona, I’ve always support you but after this, not anymore. These are “The Olympics” !, do you know what does it mean?.
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United States

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This is what Pep has to say on the whole Olympic issue (taken from the FCB website):
“Blatter had better decide because it is Leo who is losing out at the moment. I’m tired of this. I think FIFA should say something now”.
I totally agree, whatever the decision is let’s just get it over with because this whole thing is a distraction we don’t need right now.
Posted from
Canada

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bAllbeav,
yeh that buildup is exciting. #2 is Alves, I think, …wow…”DANGER Will Robinson” on the right!re Olympics, Pep is right, and Blatter decides and let’s work this out before next Olympics
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United States

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Dany, if you want to bail on the club because of the Olympics thing, then knock yourself out. “More than a club” also means bigger than any one player. Whatever the outcome of the Messi thing, I’m a cule and a soci right down to the core.
But to each their own.
Now. I have to say (and really, that sound is my guts being wrenched out) Gudjohnsen scored two very nice goals. And Krkic is definitely the goods. Yaya looked like his old self as well, with that howtizer leg of his. All in all, a very nice display.
But let us not forget that we destroyed Inter 5-0 in the Gamper match last season. Inter was a much more significant opponent, and look what last season turned into.
Guardiola is right about where Messi gets the ball. We’ve all been saying that he needs to get the ball closer to the box, which doesn’t allow defenses as much time to set up for his attacks. When that happens, he’s much more dangerous.
I like him attacking goal. Rock on. He’s more of an attacker and less of a midfielder anyhow. Make it so, I say. He’ll get better at attacking.
I’m much more encouraged by the touch, pace and energy that the lads played with. That seems to be the biggest difference in the Guardiola regime. They didn’t have that much Pep at any time last season that I can recall, even during the early season and the matches that we can all recall as being killers.
And I have to tell you, when Messi and Alves REALLY learn to play together, you are going to see some serious destruction there. I think that when Guardiola talks about a left winger with some mojo, he envisions that same effect from whomever that person is and Henry.
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It’s interesting. I could be misinterpreting, but it seems that Guardiola actually supports Messi’s Olympic wishes. Otherwise, why would he state that ‘it is Leo who is losing out at the moment.’ If he does think Messi should be allowed to go, than the pressure for him to stay is coming from up top, from Laporta and the board etc.
And Kevin, I’m not sure that ‘More than a club’ means that you don’t give a damn about the individuals that compose it.
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United States

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It sure sounds like Pep is behind Messi’s Olympic bid and I wouldn’t be surprised if it was because he won a gold medal with Spain in ‘92. Not surprising, then, that he would hold the Olympics up as a great tournament and would support other players who have the opportunity to go.
As for “More than a club,” I think what Kevin meant was that no player is greater than any other and is expected to give to the club as much as all the others, not that the team doesn’t care about its players.
I would never abandon Barça over such a petty thing as whether Messi goes to the Olympics or not (after all, my opinion of the Olympics is not positive), but precisely because it is such a petty thing, then he really should be allowed to go if he wants to. I am opposed to him leaving, but if he wants to go, then he should be allowed to go and he should be sent off with some sort of “You’re a great guy, come back soon and healthy” fanfare.
I seem to have forgotten to make that point in my post…I just think Messi is above the Olympics in skill. Still, a gold medal would be nice to add to the mantel…
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United States

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You’re right, John. But it does mean that as a fan, your support of the entity should be there. You can be against some of the decisions the club makes. Absolutely. If we keep Eto’o I think we’re crazy, but I will never stop supporting the club. I love Henry, but no matter what we do, I won’t stop being a fan or him or the club. As with Ronaldinho, I would wish him well in his new home, until he came to the Nou Camp.
I would bet that the board is behind the Messi stance. Why, I don’t know. I still go back and forth on that one. I still don’t know what harm it would cause to let him go, but if they have the “no special treatment” worldview, I can understand that, as well. The problem is in flexibility, which I don’t believe they are showing right now.
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United States

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I think we should use him for the first leg to ensure our qualification and then let him roam free.
If he hits form there and hits the ground running for La Liga every one of us will be delighted. He is definitely a form player and winning the Olympic games would have to be good for us long term.
And there is every bit as much possibility that he gets injured against Boca in the Gamper. On the flip side… if Gudiola is focussing on the overall fitness of the team and thinks that going to Beijing will be bad fis long term fitness then I’d understand.Dani Alves and Messi were impressive together down the right. On the other side the left winger will have to give width as well as being able to go it alone on occassion as Abidal will be staying at home more than Alves. Silva does not offer enough of what we want. Between Hleb and Iniesta we have more of everything than Silva gives us and we can’t just buy him for the sake of it. Thiago Neves would stay out wide but I’m not sure if he would be ready for a 30/40 game La Liga/Champs League season. Arshavin would be better equipped but his transfer would be less likely.
It’s such a pity that we couldn’t sign Quaresma again. If you give him the ball out wide he will either take someone on or get the ball into the box with quality. He is the only person on the planet to match Dani Alves’ quality in crossing and he can play both wings. If we are prepared to give Valencia €30million for Silva who adds nothing to the squad (statistically) then why not offer Porto €25million for Quaresma who would add pace, crossing, goals and bucketloads of assists.
Commercially, Quaresma’s skills and image would be good for the club, something that will be welcome with the departure of Deco and Ronnie.Let the above paragraph have nothing to do with the fact that he is probably my favourite player outside the Messiah.
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i also like the idea of him joining the national side late, but the AFA isnt down with this.
the dundee-barca game is 11 am eastern time (US), but i am wondering if it will be streamed live or delayed. anyone who finds a live streaming site please paste the link here tomorrow (saturday) morning.
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United States

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Laporta,deja ir a Messi a Beijing!!!!!!!!!
El mundo tiene derecho de verlo jugar en las olimpiadas!!Posted from
Italy

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On the news front, we have apparently offered Lyon Eto’o plus cash for Benzema. This obviously won’t happen, but I think that it’s more to make clear that with all of our activity, we haven’t forgotten about the talented forward.
Aulas isn’t crazy. Yes, Lyon are interested in Eto’o, though they won’t be once they see his wage demands. Players leave Ligue Un to make that kind of money. Eto’o is, frankly, crazy to think anyone is going to pay that kind of money for a 27-year-old striker who is coming off of consecutive seasons with serious injuries.
If we could get Eto’o to relax his salary demands, I wouldn’t be surprised to see us do a slightly cut-rate deal for Eto’o that includes first rights to Benzema.
Oh, and we’re maybe looking at bidding 20 million for Trezeguet. I say maybe, because you have heard nothing real from our end of things, and Trezeguet seems pretty happy at Juventus. I’d do the deal for 20 million, as a short-term stopgap until guys like Benzema can develop and we can make a for-real call on them. But 20 million for one of the world’s best in-the-box strikers, who also works very well with Henry, would be a deal.
I can already hear the Eto’o is so much better than Trezeguet stuff, and I’ll leave folks to that. Trezeguet is different than Eto’o, and possibly better for Guardiola’s desired single striker at front, backed by Henry and Messi. And Trezeguet scores goals in the catennacio world of Serie A.
But I just don’t place any faith in the rumor mill. I’m in “wait and see mode.”
Besides, we have the goal-crazy Gudjohnsen, right?

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United States

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Ciaran, what’s the status of Quaresma? Last I read, Inter were throwing about 25 million at Porto to prise him loose.
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Eto’o for Benzema would be perfect. It would really kill two birds with one stone. How much cash are we thinking would be involved? Or would it just be first option. I don’t want to get my hopes up though, so I will try and be with Kxevin in his “wait and see” mode.
Trezeguet would be great though. Like Kxevin said, he links up well with Henry, and with Hleb there too, we would definately get the best out of Henry. 20 million would be a decent price too.
Still, we need Arshavin. We are crazy to pass up an opportunity like this. He has a brilliant passion for the club, which is just what we need.
Posted from
Australia

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you can find streaming barcelona-dundee here:
http://www.humsurfer.com/view/live-streaming-dundee-united-vs-barcelona-online-friendly-matches
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United States

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Try this otherwise, its working for me

http://livefooty.doctor-serv.com/sat26.7/Dundee_Barcelona.htmlPosted from
United States

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